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1 00:00:11,919 --> 00:00:15,059 Welcome back, everybody, to Pull Hook Golf, the podcast. 2 00:00:15,675 --> 00:00:17,114 I'm your host, Matt Cook. 3 00:00:17,114 --> 00:00:20,495 And today, we have a fascinating episode for you. 4 00:00:20,795 --> 00:00:25,675 Joining us is a visionary in the sports world development, product innovation, and golf 5 00:00:25,675 --> 00:00:26,175 disruption.
6 00:00:26,795 --> 00:00:28,095 Ted Simons is here. 7 00:00:28,579 --> 00:00:32,280 And, man, Ted's resume is extensive, folks. 8 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:38,659 He began his journey in retail sporting goods for Razzignol in ski and tennis and then 9 00:00:38,659 --> 00:00:41,719 evolved into a leader in video and film production. 10 00:00:42,295 --> 00:00:47,414 Then founded Synergy Group Marketing, where he's led iconic sports projects for clients 11 00:00:47,414 --> 00:00:49,814 like Wilson Sporting Goods, U.S.
12 00:00:49,814 --> 00:00:56,554 Ski Team, Yonex Golf, if you remember Yonex, everybody, ProForm Fitness, and Nicklaus 13 00:00:56,774 --> 00:00:57,274 Academies. 14 00:00:58,079 --> 00:01:03,760 But I do want to give a brief overview of what you're going to be listening to today with Ted. 15 00:01:03,760 --> 00:01:05,780 We're going to dive deep into Ted's background. 16 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:09,859 We're going to get his experience with international sports initiatives.
17 00:01:10,375 --> 00:01:15,575 And then, of course, we've got to talk a little bit about LIV Golf and the PGA Tour, the 18 00:01:15,575 --> 00:01:19,594 rivalry there, and where he thinks the golf industry is headed. 19 00:01:19,655 --> 00:01:20,954 Welcome to the show, Ted. 20 00:01:21,174 --> 00:01:22,054 Thank you very much. 21 00:01:22,054 --> 00:01:23,174 Appreciate you having me, Matt.
22 00:01:23,174 --> 00:01:23,814 Worth a call. 23 00:01:23,814 --> 00:01:24,534 It's my pleasure. 24 00:01:24,534 --> 00:01:25,754 We had a great conversation. 25 00:01:26,159 --> 00:01:29,960 You actually were reaching out to me around a couple people that you work with that you want 26 00:01:29,960 --> 00:01:30,880 to have on the show.
27 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,200 And the more that we got talking, I'm like, you know what? 28 00:01:33,200 --> 00:01:39,344 I absolutely have to have you on an episode because you have so much insight. 29 00:01:39,405 --> 00:01:44,284 And what's awesome is you've worked a lot internationally, which I don't think I talk to 30 00:01:44,284 --> 00:01:49,084 enough people in the golf industry that have that experience, and that's where it's going to 31 00:01:49,084 --> 00:01:51,165 lead us into the LIV Golf side of things. 32 00:01:51,165 --> 00:01:54,120 But first off, I want to get into your background, your approach.
33 00:01:54,280 --> 00:01:56,299 Now you've had such a varied career. 34 00:01:57,000 --> 00:02:02,600 From sports products to film production and now golf development, can you walk us through how 35 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:06,939 your career evolved and what led to where you're at today? 36 00:02:08,074 --> 00:02:14,074 I wish I had a road map to be able to show you and share all this with you. 37 00:02:14,074 --> 00:02:22,810 But, yeah, I just, you know, moved and shaped and went where my career took me, where my 38 00:02:22,810 --> 00:02:23,930 relationships took me.
39 00:02:23,930 --> 00:02:26,889 So, yeah, I started in retail sporting goods. 40 00:02:26,889 --> 00:02:33,610 I was a baseball player, but, you know, once I got there, my goal, my vision was to become a 41 00:02:33,610 --> 00:02:34,169 ski rep. 42 00:02:34,169 --> 00:02:35,710 That's all I wanted to do. 43 00:02:35,955 --> 00:02:39,314 These guys and gals, they—I mean, they were my idols.
44 00:02:39,314 --> 00:02:43,974 They were the pinnacle of—I mean, if I got to that, I was done. 45 00:02:44,435 --> 00:02:48,294 And, sure enough, I was able to get there. 46 00:02:48,890 --> 00:02:55,450 And oddly enough, at the ripe age of 34, I decided I didn't wanna be an old rep, maybe, 47 00:02:55,689 --> 00:02:59,310 you know, standing on the plaza Snowbird freezing my butt off. 48 00:03:00,010 --> 00:03:03,390 Yeah, it taught me that maybe there's a different path here.
49 00:03:03,985 --> 00:03:12,064 And so, yeah, I left the repping, got into the video production world, focused on sports and 50 00:03:12,064 --> 00:03:18,030 resorts, and, yep, figured out that, you know, I was unemployable, if you will. 51 00:03:18,270 --> 00:03:21,009 I don't really fit into corporate structure. 52 00:03:21,789 --> 00:03:27,069 So, I was given the opportunity to start my own company, and that's when I founded Synergy 53 00:03:27,069 --> 00:03:27,810 Group Marketing. 54 00:03:28,750 --> 00:03:32,530 And from there, I just, you know, continue to evolve.
55 00:03:33,705 --> 00:03:33,944 Yeah. 56 00:03:33,944 --> 00:03:40,025 I started writing video scripts because I couldn't find producers that understood what I 57 00:03:40,025 --> 00:03:48,770 wanted from a product information piece for Yonex Golf or Yonex Tennis, Wilson Sporting 58 00:03:48,770 --> 00:03:50,530 Goods, those types of things. 59 00:03:50,530 --> 00:03:57,969 So, I started to write scripts, started to produce, started to shoot my own video, because 60 00:03:57,969 --> 00:03:59,830 I knew what I wanted to see. 61 00:04:00,465 --> 00:04:10,224 And that was just a great company that I built, and everything just kind of evolved.
62 00:04:10,224 --> 00:04:12,564 I got more into fitness. 63 00:04:14,610 --> 00:04:14,849 Yeah. 64 00:04:14,849 --> 00:04:23,410 Fitness manufacturers led me to NASM, which led me down other paths, other technologies, and 65 00:04:23,410 --> 00:04:28,564 eventually, I got introduced to the group that was running Nicklaus Academies. 66 00:04:28,944 --> 00:04:36,625 And after a period of consulting with them, they brought me on board as executive VP and 67 00:04:36,625 --> 00:04:37,125 COO.
68 00:04:37,904 --> 00:04:42,879 And I had the opportunity, the privilege of representing Mr. 69 00:04:42,879 --> 00:04:45,060 Nicklaus around the world for 18 years. 70 00:04:45,439 --> 00:04:45,759 Wow. 71 00:04:45,759 --> 00:04:46,500 That's incredible.
72 00:04:46,639 --> 00:04:52,900 Now, obviously, you love working with products as well as on projects around these. 73 00:04:53,120 --> 00:04:59,125 Can you share some examples for the audience of how getting into the details made a difference 74 00:04:59,504 --> 00:05:01,045 in a project's success? 75 00:05:02,064 --> 00:05:02,384 Yeah. 76 00:05:02,384 --> 00:05:06,805 I'm weird because I don't understand manufacturing.
77 00:05:07,105 --> 00:05:08,645 I'm certainly not an engineer. 78 00:05:09,345 --> 00:05:17,100 But little things like going to the factories and seeing how they lay up Rossignol skis, 79 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:18,600 which has changed now. 80 00:05:18,600 --> 00:05:23,500 But, you know, seeing how they lay things so you understood, you know, all the components 81 00:05:23,879 --> 00:05:27,180 that went into making a product perform. 82 00:05:28,875 --> 00:05:36,314 One of my more interesting ones is we went and filmed how you make Wilson tennis balls, which 83 00:05:36,314 --> 00:05:40,894 was—I think I can still smell the factory, the resins.
84 00:05:41,329 --> 00:05:45,509 I may still have some of the felt, you know, somewhere in my DNA. 85 00:05:46,529 --> 00:05:54,610 But, you know, getting into and watching the people doing the work and, you know, their 86 00:05:54,610 --> 00:06:01,875 care, their precision to come out, you know, to at the end of the production, you know, sees 87 00:06:01,875 --> 00:06:02,115 it. 88 00:06:02,115 --> 00:06:07,175 You know, they wanted that Wilson tennis ball to be the best ball on the market. 89 00:06:08,610 --> 00:06:13,110 From there now, it's easy to produce a video about it because you can share the passion.
90 00:06:13,169 --> 00:06:18,389 You can share their attention to detail, their commitment to the brand. 91 00:06:19,250 --> 00:06:26,004 And when I got those opportunities to see how things get made, how the engineers design 92 00:06:26,004 --> 00:06:35,045 things, it made it really, really easy to produce their marketing pieces, their product 93 00:06:35,045 --> 00:06:40,129 information pieces that, yeah, I became passionate about. 94 00:06:40,129 --> 00:06:41,729 I love my clients. 95 00:06:41,729 --> 00:06:42,870 I love their projects.
96 00:06:43,009 --> 00:06:43,169 So 97 00:06:44,289 --> 00:06:45,729 I gotta go back to Mr. 98 00:06:45,729 --> 00:06:49,269 Nicklaus's brand because, obviously, we're on a golf podcast. 99 00:06:49,569 --> 00:06:53,444 I wanna find out working with the Golden Bear and so forth. 100 00:06:53,985 --> 00:06:59,345 But before we do, now within working with Mr.
101 00:06:59,345 --> 00:07:01,525 Nicklaus, you worked a lot internationally. 102 00:07:02,145 --> 00:07:02,625 Right? 103 00:07:02,625 --> 00:07:05,925 So you worked in Brazil, I believe, India, and China. 104 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:11,300 What was it like working in those markets, and how did you kinda ensure that those projects 105 00:07:11,439 --> 00:07:15,379 succeeded within that international brand?
106 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:20,884 Well, I mean, it goes back to, you know, almost, you know, the manufacturing. 107 00:07:21,345 --> 00:07:27,444 I visited, I think I counted 54 countries to establish 28 locations. 108 00:07:28,464 --> 00:07:35,919 So, yeah, I woke up and, you know, I'm on the coast of Croatia going, where the hell am I? 109 00:07:35,919 --> 00:07:37,699 I'm on the Mediterranean somewhere.
110 00:07:39,120 --> 00:07:39,360 Yeah. 111 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:43,779 So being able to travel internationally, and I traveled alone. 112 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:50,055 You know, me and my carry-on bag and my backpack with a laptop and a cell phone and, 113 00:07:50,055 --> 00:07:56,034 you know, just hope that I got picked up by the person that I was trying to communicate with. 114 00:07:57,294 --> 00:07:57,534 Yeah.
115 00:07:57,534 --> 00:08:02,254 But, you know, having the golden bear, you know, as on your business card, I mean, you 116 00:08:02,254 --> 00:08:04,194 know, talk about opening doors. 117 00:08:05,620 --> 00:08:05,860 Yeah. 118 00:08:05,860 --> 00:08:11,539 That was the first step, but, you know, really getting to know the people, getting to know the 119 00:08:11,539 --> 00:08:18,019 projects, the lay of the land, walking the, you know, walking the earth, if you will, to make 120 00:08:18,019 --> 00:08:24,285 sure that who you're dealing with, the projects you're looking at, what the market potential 121 00:08:24,504 --> 00:08:27,865 is, added to Mr. 122 00:08:27,865 --> 00:08:32,924 Nicklaus's bucket, right, and did not take away from his brand.
123 00:08:33,465 --> 00:08:36,399 And so, yep, that's a, you know, I yeah. 124 00:08:36,399 --> 00:08:45,519 It's a tremendous responsibility that, you know, I took obviously very seriously, and I 125 00:08:45,519 --> 00:08:52,264 passed that on to, you know, my eventual clients that, you know, I negotiated 20-year 126 00:08:52,264 --> 00:08:53,324 agreements with. 127 00:08:53,944 --> 00:08:57,404 You're I mean, you're talking about a long-term marriage here. 128 00:08:57,704 --> 00:09:04,629 So you've got to make sure that you've got the right people that are funding the project, that 129 00:09:04,629 --> 00:09:11,029 are going to be behind the project for the long haul, and then working with them to design, to 130 00:09:11,029 --> 00:09:19,704 develop, to create that experience and hiring people that didn't work for me, that didn't 131 00:09:19,704 --> 00:09:20,764 work for the client.
132 00:09:21,384 --> 00:09:26,264 Every day they put that shirt on, that hat on, they represented Mr. 133 00:09:26,264 --> 00:09:26,764 Nicklaus. 134 00:09:27,945 --> 00:09:28,745 And yeah. 135 00:09:28,745 --> 00:09:30,384 I was working with Jack, by the way.
136 00:09:30,384 --> 00:09:35,309 I don't mean to interrupt you, but you're enticing me here with talking about all of 137 00:09:35,309 --> 00:09:35,549 this. 138 00:09:35,549 --> 00:09:37,570 I'm like, how was the Golden Bear? 139 00:09:38,429 --> 00:09:41,070 Well, you know, Golden Bear is like every one of us. 140 00:09:41,070 --> 00:09:41,389 You know?
141 00:09:41,389 --> 00:09:43,470 We all have good days, and we have bad days. 142 00:09:43,470 --> 00:09:51,274 And, you know, I was told by Jack early on that you don't want a phone call from me. 143 00:09:52,454 --> 00:09:57,115 That means I've maybe made a mistake somewhere. 144 00:09:57,730 --> 00:10:07,649 So as long as, yeah, he put the trust in our organization to represent his brand and, yep, I 145 00:10:07,649 --> 00:10:08,870 would report in.
146 00:10:09,090 --> 00:10:09,970 I would see Jack. 147 00:10:09,970 --> 00:10:14,144 I would fly into Florida and see him in the office from time to time. 148 00:10:14,764 --> 00:10:21,804 I would have the luxury of kind of melding design projects with an academy project to 149 00:10:21,804 --> 00:10:31,089 being able to be on the ground with Jack and really show off what we were doing in his name. 150 00:10:32,190 --> 00:10:32,669 Yep.
151 00:10:32,669 --> 00:10:41,054 And, yeah, that part of it was very gratifying because if you think about the brand, the 152 00:10:41,054 --> 00:10:43,634 academies were the only thing that touched the customer. 153 00:10:45,134 --> 00:10:48,014 You can have 400 golf courses around the world. 154 00:10:48,014 --> 00:10:49,294 You can have ice cream. 155 00:10:49,294 --> 00:10:50,335 You can have shirts.
156 00:10:50,335 --> 00:10:51,794 You can have golf clubs. 157 00:10:52,174 --> 00:10:57,079 But at the end of the day, the only person touching the golfer is a golf instructor. 158 00:10:57,459 --> 00:10:58,440 That's good boys. 159 00:10:58,740 --> 00:11:05,139 So we took that as our responsibility, our mantra as, yep.
160 00:11:05,139 --> 00:11:07,934 I think it's an overused term now, but, yeah. 161 00:11:08,335 --> 00:11:16,095 Yeah, growing the game in these developing countries where golf is, you know, not what it 162 00:11:16,095 --> 00:11:24,190 is in America, not what it is in the UK or Scotland, knowing that you're going in and 163 00:11:24,889 --> 00:11:34,004 putting an academy in Guam or Jakarta, yeah, or Tsingtao, of all places. 164 00:11:34,004 --> 00:11:36,825 I mean, yeah, even outside of Sao Paulo. 165 00:11:37,445 --> 00:11:37,945 Yeah.
166 00:11:39,205 --> 00:11:42,985 golf instruction in many of these markets never existed. 167 00:11:43,684 --> 00:11:50,790 And when you come in with a brand like Nicklaus and the facilities that we were able to design 168 00:11:50,929 --> 00:12:00,450 and have built and outfitted and bring in the expat pros to teach Jack's philosophy, and 169 00:12:00,450 --> 00:12:02,210 again, represent Mr. 170 00:12:02,210 --> 00:12:05,955 Nicklaus, kinda mean what you know, what a blast. 171 00:12:07,134 --> 00:12:10,335 A lot of fun, but I gotta imagine there's some complexity there.
172 00:12:10,335 --> 00:12:10,654 Right? 173 00:12:10,654 --> 00:12:17,235 Not working in the United States and bringing these new academies to these different markets. 174 00:12:17,629 --> 00:12:23,470 What are some glaring differences between kinda setting something up here domestically versus 175 00:12:23,470 --> 00:12:25,009 going international like that? 176 00:12:25,950 --> 00:12:32,209 Well, when we would design coaching studios, we would provide the architects and the engineers 177 00:12:32,429 --> 00:12:33,774 with our specifications.
178 00:12:35,115 --> 00:12:41,274 And, you know, you would constantly be on the phone or email, you know, ensuring that these 179 00:12:41,274 --> 00:12:45,535 specifications were being adhered to and being, yeah, being guaranteed. 180 00:12:45,595 --> 00:12:46,154 No problem. 181 00:12:46,154 --> 00:12:47,039 Don't worry, Mr. 182 00:12:47,039 --> 00:12:47,279 Simons.
183 00:12:47,279 --> 00:12:48,159 Don't worry, Mr. 184 00:12:48,159 --> 00:12:48,559 Simons. 185 00:12:48,559 --> 00:12:49,459 We've got it. 186 00:12:50,159 --> 00:12:52,899 And, you know, Qingdao is a perfect example.
187 00:12:53,199 --> 00:12:53,519 Yeah. 188 00:12:53,519 --> 00:13:01,039 Fly in to, you know, back in those days, install the equipment, put in the high-speed 189 00:13:01,039 --> 00:13:05,324 cameras and the pressure mat and the launch monitors and the computers. 190 00:13:06,184 --> 00:13:13,485 And instead of having a 3-inch conduit, you had a 1 and a half inch conduit. 191 00:13:14,159 --> 00:13:18,339 You can't feed cables through that size conduit.
192 00:13:18,959 --> 00:13:24,159 And, you know, just looking at them going, you know, you have to tear out the concrete. 193 00:13:24,159 --> 00:13:25,360 We have to tear out the walls. 194 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:26,820 We have to start over again. 195 00:13:27,625 --> 00:13:28,125 And, 196 00:13:28,904 --> 00:13:30,445 That's gotta be a tough conversation.
197 00:13:31,065 --> 00:13:35,725 That's a it's a tough conversation, because sometimes there are language differences. 198 00:13:35,865 --> 00:13:38,204 My Chinese is not very good. 199 00:13:39,384 --> 00:13:41,700 My Korean is not very good. 200 00:13:41,779 --> 00:13:44,200 I figured out early on, don't try.
201 00:13:45,139 --> 00:13:50,580 All you're going to do is butcher and offend, so make sure you have a translator wherever you 202 00:13:50,580 --> 00:13:51,080 go. 203 00:13:51,779 --> 00:13:53,879 But, yeah, tough conversation to say. 204 00:13:54,100 --> 00:13:54,465 Yep. 205 00:13:54,545 --> 00:13:56,805 We, you know, we've gotta start over again.
206 00:13:57,985 --> 00:13:59,445 Imagine being the interpreter. 207 00:14:01,985 --> 00:14:07,049 You're telling them what to say, and then they gotta relay the tough message. 208 00:14:07,049 --> 00:14:12,490 They've gotta relay the tough message, and you have to, you know, you have to keep that, you 209 00:14:12,490 --> 00:14:14,410 know, that face on, if you will. 210 00:14:14,410 --> 00:14:17,870 And and, you know, that's what they call it, saving face in Asia.
211 00:14:18,809 --> 00:14:27,774 You know, you have to maintain your, you know, your confidence and not look like a jerk, while 212 00:14:27,835 --> 00:14:33,294 ensuring that they understand in a polite way they made a mistake. 213 00:14:34,315 --> 00:14:35,754 It's not my fault. 214 00:14:35,754 --> 00:14:36,735 It's your expense. 215 00:14:37,649 --> 00:14:43,029 And, I guess I will be back in two weeks, and we'll start over again.
216 00:14:43,490 --> 00:14:49,110 So jump on a plane and, you know, come back to the States and, do it all over again. 217 00:14:50,529 --> 00:14:51,350 That's incredible. 218 00:14:51,569 --> 00:14:52,529 Tell me a little bit. 219 00:14:52,529 --> 00:14:56,705 So moving beyond the Nicklaus brand, what are some recent projects that you've been working 220 00:14:56,705 --> 00:14:57,205 on?
221 00:14:58,144 --> 00:14:58,545 Yeah. 222 00:14:58,545 --> 00:14:59,665 We've been, Yeah. 223 00:14:59,665 --> 00:15:04,785 And I'm I'm not at liberty to announce, but we have a, you know, I was contracted to put 224 00:15:04,785 --> 00:15:07,445 together a branded academy in Vietnam. 225 00:15:08,750 --> 00:15:09,149 Yep.
226 00:15:09,149 --> 00:15:10,690 So okay. 227 00:15:10,750 --> 00:15:17,809 They give me a list of, you know, top 10 names that, yeah, are recognizable to them. 228 00:15:19,629 --> 00:15:28,875 And my job is to go out and, yep, negotiate with a, yeah, with a high-level well-known 229 00:15:28,875 --> 00:15:35,134 instructor that has the interest in expanding their brand in Vietnam. 230 00:15:37,320 --> 00:15:37,559 Yeah.
231 00:15:37,559 --> 00:15:42,620 Interesting enough, I just, you know, got off the phone before we got on and, you know, in 232 00:15:42,759 --> 00:15:43,899 talks in India. 233 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:55,184 You know, looking at how you can, you know, put together golf projects to, you know, introduce 234 00:15:55,184 --> 00:16:00,564 the game to more and more people because in India, land is very difficult to put together. 235 00:16:01,424 --> 00:16:01,745 Yeah. 236 00:16:01,745 --> 00:16:06,725 Every literally every citizen in India, I swear, owns a piece of land.
237 00:16:07,769 --> 00:16:15,370 And, you know, getting, you know, 30 or 40 or 50 landowners to agree to yeah. 238 00:16:15,370 --> 00:16:23,254 Or more to put together a golf course is almost impossible, which is why growing, yeah, golf 239 00:16:23,254 --> 00:16:26,875 course development is tough in India, not to mention water. 240 00:16:27,495 --> 00:16:29,414 So that's where yeah. 241 00:16:29,414 --> 00:16:32,454 How do you put together innovative driving ranges?
242 00:16:32,454 --> 00:16:34,714 How do you put together short courses? 243 00:16:36,330 --> 00:16:37,769 You know, it could be three holes. 244 00:16:37,769 --> 00:16:38,889 It could be six holes. 245 00:16:38,889 --> 00:16:39,929 It could be 12 holes.
246 00:16:39,929 --> 00:16:40,889 It could be nine. 247 00:16:40,889 --> 00:16:41,870 It doesn't matter. 248 00:16:42,649 --> 00:16:49,289 How do you, you know, how do you assemble enough land and bring together a creative golf 249 00:16:49,289 --> 00:16:49,789 experience? 250 00:16:51,164 --> 00:16:55,664 Because at the end of the day, you know, I'm all about, you know, what is the experience?
251 00:16:55,804 --> 00:16:58,384 What is the customer's experience? 252 00:16:58,524 --> 00:17:00,225 What is the golfer's experience? 253 00:17:01,164 --> 00:17:05,984 And, you know, whether it's a Nicklaus brand or somebody else's brand or nobody's brand. 254 00:17:07,319 --> 00:17:07,640 Yeah.
255 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:08,779 What is your experience? 256 00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:13,500 That's why you come back a second time, a third time, a fourth time. 257 00:17:14,039 --> 00:17:18,140 Great marketing, great design, will get you there once. 258 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:26,484 But if your experience is crappy, why would you come back and spend your time and spend your 259 00:17:26,484 --> 00:17:26,984 money?
260 00:17:27,444 --> 00:17:35,125 And I think that's where a lot of projects, not just golf, but a lot of projects fall short is 261 00:17:35,125 --> 00:17:40,559 they don't look at the end consumer who, you know, who are we designing for? 262 00:17:41,340 --> 00:17:47,820 And if we can't achieve that, poof, you know, we've wasted a whole lot of time and money to 263 00:17:47,820 --> 00:17:50,240 build the Taj Mahal that nobody wants. 264 00:17:51,805 --> 00:17:53,025 That's really interesting. 265 00:17:53,244 --> 00:17:59,424 And just that dynamic that you just mentioned, and it sounds like I mean, especially bringing 266 00:17:59,644 --> 00:18:05,460 golf courses over to, let's say, India sounds not only complicated and complex, but at the 267 00:18:05,460 --> 00:18:08,980 same time like it's kind of a disruptor within that market.
268 00:18:08,980 --> 00:18:12,900 So now we got to dive into the hot topic which is LIV Golf. 269 00:18:12,900 --> 00:18:20,164 I mean it has been the—and we're just gonna get right into it because, really working with 270 00:18:20,164 --> 00:18:26,884 disruptors and bringing to new markets and so forth, how do you think LIV Golf is or how do 271 00:18:26,884 --> 00:18:29,545 you see them as a disruptor in the market? 272 00:18:29,924 --> 00:18:33,065 And ultimately, do you think it's good for the game? 273 00:18:34,649 --> 00:18:43,210 Well, yeah, in I think in the traditional sense, especially with the PGA Tour, yeah.
274 00:18:43,210 --> 00:18:45,869 You know, for sure, LIV is a disruptor. 275 00:18:47,444 --> 00:18:53,765 If you go to Bangkok, Thailand to a LIV event, you're not disrupting anything. 276 00:18:53,765 --> 00:18:59,224 You're bringing the best players in the world to your country. 277 00:18:59,365 --> 00:19:05,109 They don't care if it's 54 holes, a shotgun, you know, music, whatever.
278 00:19:05,490 --> 00:19:12,549 They're having the opportunities that the PGA Tour would never give them by traveling to, 279 00:19:13,089 --> 00:19:20,464 yeah, to traveling to Thailand or bringing, yeah, a major tour with big stars back to 280 00:19:20,464 --> 00:19:20,964 Australia. 281 00:19:23,024 --> 00:19:24,325 So yes. 282 00:19:24,865 --> 00:19:25,184 Yeah. 283 00:19:25,184 --> 00:19:26,484 Are they going to Chicago?
284 00:19:26,704 --> 00:19:28,544 Are big crowds gonna show up? 285 00:19:28,544 --> 00:19:29,744 You know, who knows? 286 00:19:29,744 --> 00:19:31,125 Maybe, maybe not. 287 00:19:32,099 --> 00:19:35,880 Not everybody is into their model and their presentation.
288 00:19:36,980 --> 00:19:45,144 But outside of, you know, the protected borders of the United States, yeah, LIV is, you know, 289 00:19:45,144 --> 00:19:50,684 LIV is making a difference in exposing the game of golf. 290 00:19:51,065 --> 00:19:52,285 Is it growing it? 291 00:19:52,985 --> 00:19:53,545 I don't know. 292 00:19:53,545 --> 00:19:59,679 That's up to, you know, that's up to, I guess, people like me and others that are developing 293 00:19:59,980 --> 00:20:07,179 projects that reach the masses, but they're exposing the game of golf and, you know, to 294 00:20:07,419 --> 00:20:12,625 show up and, you know, see Jon Rahm, to see Phil Mickelson.
295 00:20:15,164 --> 00:20:15,484 Hell. 296 00:20:15,484 --> 00:20:19,085 I mean, if I was in Thailand, I would buy a ticket and go see it. 297 00:20:19,085 --> 00:20:19,585 Right? 298 00:20:20,365 --> 00:20:23,025 Because you would not ever have that opportunity.
299 00:20:23,164 --> 00:20:26,279 So for that reason, sure. 300 00:20:26,339 --> 00:20:33,720 You know, it is it's exposing masses, millions and millions of people to the game of golf. 301 00:20:33,940 --> 00:20:37,700 I think you raise a really good point with the international aspect because outside of the 302 00:20:37,700 --> 00:20:44,315 United States, I mean, we get so often, and this was kind of an awakening for me as well as 303 00:20:44,315 --> 00:20:51,994 I say this, around the fact that especially when I started interacting on Twitter or X, and 304 00:20:51,994 --> 00:20:57,000 all of a sudden, you start getting these international opinions and you start to see 305 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:02,920 kind of how, you know, a lot of people are against the PGA Tour from international areas, 306 00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:07,259 and it tends to be Australia, tends to be the UK a little bit. 307 00:21:07,640 --> 00:21:12,515 And it's really interesting to have this dynamic to where people within the United 308 00:21:12,515 --> 00:21:15,955 States, a lot of them are pro-PGA Tour and don't want LIV.
309 00:21:16,434 --> 00:21:20,994 Granted, there's certainly people within the United States that like LIV Golf and so forth. 310 00:21:20,994 --> 00:21:26,420 I've always played a neutral; I've always been a neutral party around it because I just don't 311 00:21:26,420 --> 00:21:31,460 take the politics as a part of the argument, and if you remove that, you just focus in on 312 00:21:31,460 --> 00:21:39,075 the golfers, then you tend to have more of a neutral opinion towards LIV Golf in particular. 313 00:21:39,295 --> 00:21:44,894 But again, going back to the international aspect and how it's exposing the game and it's 314 00:21:44,894 --> 00:21:49,855 bringing the game to these different areas internationally and becoming a little bit of a 315 00:21:49,855 --> 00:21:50,835 global tour. 316 00:21:50,975 --> 00:21:58,840 But do you think that with it being more on the global aspect, and them talking about this and 317 00:21:58,840 --> 00:22:04,519 bringing these players over and exposing them to these new areas, that it should have more of 318 00:22:04,519 --> 00:22:10,375 an international focus than even what it has today, where still we've got multiple 319 00:22:10,434 --> 00:22:14,535 tournaments throughout the year taking place here in the United States?
320 00:22:16,355 --> 00:22:16,595 Yeah. 321 00:22:16,595 --> 00:22:24,690 I mean, you know, LIV has to make a mark in the States to be, you know, whatever successful is 322 00:22:24,690 --> 00:22:25,349 to them. 323 00:22:25,890 --> 00:22:26,210 Right? 324 00:22:26,210 --> 00:22:29,109 I mean, you have to have the number one media market.
325 00:22:30,450 --> 00:22:36,884 You have to have that exposure or I'm not so sure the ultimate business model works, 326 00:22:38,164 --> 00:22:39,545 whatever that may be. 327 00:22:40,404 --> 00:22:46,565 But, you know, not only do you see, you know, like, the excitement of a LIV tournament coming 328 00:22:46,565 --> 00:22:56,139 to these countries in these areas, you also see players that are on LIV that are no longer able 329 00:22:56,139 --> 00:23:04,299 to play PGA Tour events, they can play DP Tour events to get their world points so they can 330 00:23:04,299 --> 00:23:05,599 qualify for majors. 331 00:23:06,585 --> 00:23:12,345 And so all of a sudden, you've got, again, world-class players that are playing, you know, 332 00:23:12,345 --> 00:23:17,085 Asian Tour events, whoever sanctioning whatever to get points. 333 00:23:17,545 --> 00:23:17,865 Yeah.
334 00:23:17,865 --> 00:23:24,759 Now you've got, you know, the Abraham Ancers of the world playing events that you never would 335 00:23:24,759 --> 00:23:25,819 have seen before. 336 00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:34,115 So the downstream positive effect of LIV, you know, is, you know, I think it's also being 337 00:23:34,255 --> 00:23:40,914 underappreciated by, and God bless their souls, these players. 338 00:23:41,134 --> 00:23:42,674 Yes, they signed on. 339 00:23:43,215 --> 00:23:45,154 They knew what they were signing for.
340 00:23:45,535 --> 00:23:47,875 They certainly cashed the checks. 341 00:23:49,180 --> 00:23:49,420 Yeah. 342 00:23:49,420 --> 00:23:54,860 But they're still, I mean, they're out there chasing their world ranking points to get into 343 00:23:54,860 --> 00:24:00,779 majors and, you know, knock on wood, you know, one of these days, you know, allowed to play 344 00:24:00,779 --> 00:24:01,545 Ryder Cup. 345 00:24:02,984 --> 00:24:04,585 That certainly would be interesting.
346 00:24:04,585 --> 00:24:09,144 I know a lot of people have talked about, we'd love to see a Ryder Cup set up between LIV 347 00:24:09,144 --> 00:24:10,845 players and PGA Tour players. 348 00:24:10,904 --> 00:24:15,545 So there's that aspect too that maybe some point down the road, we get something a little 349 00:24:15,545 --> 00:24:16,265 bit like that. 350 00:24:16,265 --> 00:24:22,440 But just to have somebody, and I know Keegan Bradley as the captain of the U.S. 351 00:24:22,440 --> 00:24:25,799 Ryder Cup team for 2025 said, I want the best players in the world.
352 00:24:25,799 --> 00:24:28,619 I don't want it just to be PGA Tour players. 353 00:24:28,804 --> 00:24:34,085 So it sounds like that opens up the door once again to a Brooks Koepka, to ultimately a 354 00:24:34,085 --> 00:24:36,265 Bryson DeChambeau potentially. 355 00:24:36,484 --> 00:24:40,585 So that'll be interesting to see how that dynamic all takes place. 356 00:24:40,644 --> 00:24:46,580 But you did raise a good point around the DP World Tour and how, you know, players that you 357 00:24:46,580 --> 00:24:50,980 normally wouldn't see playing in those events are starting to play in those events because 358 00:24:50,980 --> 00:24:53,240 they need official world golf rankings.
359 00:24:53,380 --> 00:24:57,924 I don't want to go so far into the weeds with the official world golf rankings because that 360 00:24:57,924 --> 00:25:02,025 is we could have an hour-long conversation just around that alone. 361 00:25:02,644 --> 00:25:07,605 But it's kind of a cause and effect to where, you know, they aren't getting the official 362 00:25:07,605 --> 00:25:13,630 World Golf Ranking points from the LIV Golf circuit, and now they're going to have to chase 363 00:25:13,630 --> 00:25:18,049 those points and continue to get those through the DP World Tour. 364 00:25:18,109 --> 00:25:23,329 So, ultimately, do you think it's been a positive for the DP World Tour? 365 00:25:25,884 --> 00:25:35,325 I think live well, yes and no because I mean, there's some that, you know, that were, I'll 366 00:25:35,325 --> 00:25:35,965 jus
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